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Purpose & behavior of assigned number & class fields

 
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macregistrar



Joined: 07 May 2005
Posts: 13
Location: Minneapolis/Saint Paul, Minnesota

PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2007 10:37 pm    Post subject: Purpose & behavior of assigned number & class fields Reply with quote

I have a question about the intended purpose and behavior of the "Assigned Number" and "Assigned Class" fields that are available to organizers, when editing entries. My impression was that these fields are there to allow organizers to re-number and/or re-class cars. This would seem a useful capability that would allow organizers to correct errors made by entrants. However, it appears entrants can override any changes made by organizers - so I'm not sure what purpose these fields serve. Can you explain?

Thanks!

Steve Garnjobst
Minnesota Autosports Club
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MyAutoEvents
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Joined: 06 Mar 2003
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve -

The intent is exactly as you describe - event organizers should be able to correct errors or re-assign numbers or classes for any entrant and those assignments should not be editable after the fact.

I just did a test and can verify the problem at least with numbers. The assigned classes appear to work as intended - can you verify that assigned classes are or are not working for you as well?

It does appear that the assigned number functionality isn't behaving as expected or to design, so I'm going to move this to the "Bug Report" thread. I'll investigate further and update when I have it fixed.

Cool
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Steve Couture
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phile



Joined: 07 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 9:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello, Steve C.

This is Phile, the numbers guy who discovered this bug.

Yes, the "Assigned Class" window appears to override the entrant's window on the Minnesota Autosports Club registration.

The entrant's number window (labeled "Met Council Car Number" on our page) is still in final control of the number. I have already had people re-enter numbers I have removed.

My vision is that the entrant can leave the "Met Council Car Number" field blank or enter their permanent number. I'd like the entry list page to have the car number remain blank until I enter the number in the "Assigned Number" field. This way, I can glance down the list and see which entries need service. If there is a number on the list, I know it is OK and I don't have to check it again. If there is no number, the entry needs attention by the numbers guy.

Simply, the number shown on the entry list will always be the one shown in the "Assigned Number" field. If the "Assigned Number" field is blank, the "#" box on the list is blank, even if the entrant has entered something in the "Met Council Car Number" field.

Thanks for taking the time to check our system. Your service has been a great boon to the motorsports community in general and to MAC in particular!
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MyAutoEvents
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 10:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phile -

Thanks for providing additional detail.

Assigned class appears to be working, so that part is good. Now we just need to focus on your number assignment issue.

Going back into the code, I can see how this situation with the registrar-assigned number functionality got compromised. Back in the very early days of MyAutoEvents.com there was no automatic number assignment - entrants specified their number choices and it was up to the registrar to make the assignment. Obviously, this wasn't the most streamlined process so functionality was added that automated assignment of numbers based on what was currently in use/available - removing the need for the registrar to perform this action manually. But what this did was shift the priority of edits to the automated assignment process. The registrar can assign a number and it will "stick" but if a user then changes their choices, the automated process accepts that request and assigns the new number if it is available.

This is actually working as it should, however it doesn't work well in your situation where you have a very extensive list of reserved numbers and a special method for assigning the number to those not on the list. Using the new reserved number functionality would prevent this problem, but that would require all of your organization's reserved numbers to be added to MAE (I've already had an email exchange with Steve G. about this and it doesn't sound like that is something you guys want to do - although I did offer to do a bulk-load of the data on your behalf - if you are still interested let me know).

Looking at your process, I think I might have a way for you to use MAE to do exactly what you wish (no number assignment at all until you verify and assign the number). Pretty simple actually - just remove the current "Met Council Car Number" entry field from your entry form. That way the user cannot specify a number at all and the number assigned will be blank until you go in and assign one. If you want to capture a number from the entrant, but not assign it automatically, you -could- use one of the "Additional Fields" to capture this information as a reference, then assign the number manually once you have verified it as ok.

Does that make sense and satisfy your need?

Every club is different and has their own processes. MAE was built to be as flexible as possible to support these differences and not make -you- change in order to leverage this website. Sometimes it adds a bit of complexity when a process is really unique, but so far I haven't encountered too much that can't be handled.

Cool
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Steve Couture
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phile



Joined: 07 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

>Looking at your process, I think I might have a way for you to use MAE to do exactly what you wish (no number assignment at all until you verify and assign the number). Pretty simple actually - just remove the current "Met Council Car Number" entry field from your entry form. That way the user cannot specify a number at all and the number assigned will be blank until you go in and assign one. If you want to capture a number from the entrant, but not assign it automatically, you -could- use one of the "Additional Fields" to capture this information as a reference, then assign the number manually once you have verified it as ok.

Works for me. We could remove the current "Met Council Car Number" entry field which has an automatic process attached and replace it with one of the "Additional Fields" (which has no automatic process at all). The new field could be labeled "Enter your Met Council permanent number here. Explain co-drives or other number-borrowing in the Notes to Registrar box. Number will appear on entry list when approved."

I have tested, and if the (current) Met Council Car Number field is empty, entering a number in the Assigned Number field does indeed enter the number on the entry list.

So this is a change that Steve Garnjobst can make?
Or do we need to take up more of your time?
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MyAutoEvents
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 12:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

phile wrote:
Works for me. We could remove the current "Met Council Car Number" entry field which has an automatic process attached and replace it with one of the "Additional Fields" (which has no automatic process at all).


Exactly.

phile wrote:
So this is a change that Steve Garnjobst can make?


Absolutely! Very Happy

Feel free to post back here if there are any more questions. Cool
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macregistrar



Joined: 07 May 2005
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Location: Minneapolis/Saint Paul, Minnesota

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Phil & Steve,

The one problem I see with the solution you are discussing, is that I believe it will cause us to lose MAE's ability to enforce unique numbers across the event. If we lose that feature by putting numbers in a different field, then we're likely not saving any time - just shifting it to slightly different tasks.

-Steve G
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phile



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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

macregistrar wrote:
Phil & Steve,

The one problem I see with the solution you are discussing, is that I believe it will cause us to lose MAE's ability to enforce unique numbers across the event. If we lose that feature by putting numbers in a different field, then we're likely not saving any time - just shifting it to slightly different tasks.

-Steve G


Not a problem for me. I will take care of that. I was never counting on MAE for this function in the first place.
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macregistrar



Joined: 07 May 2005
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Location: Minneapolis/Saint Paul, Minnesota

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One other problem - and it's a major one. If we put car numbers in an alternate field, I'm guessing it will screw up our registration exports to AXWARE. Getting clean data to AXWARE is an absolute requirement - so we can't make any changes to the MAE entry forms that would adversely affect AXWARE.

Steve, am I correct that this would be a problem?
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MyAutoEvents
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve, you're half right.

By using MAE in the way discussed you will lose the ability to enfore number uniqueness across the event as that is part of the number assignment check that would be skipped in this scenario.

However, you would NOT lose the ability to import the entry list into AXWare. The assigned number is what is exported from MAE, so as long as every entry is assigned a number, there would be no problem.

The other alternative (and this is the last time I'll bring this up, I swear Wink ) is to use the MAE reserved number functionality as designed. This would restrict someone from taking a reserved number AND enforce the restriction mandating unique numbers across the event.
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macregistrar



Joined: 07 May 2005
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Location: Minneapolis/Saint Paul, Minnesota

PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve,

I'll work it out with Phil.

...and yes, I know the reserved number system would provide additional benefits. I just don't think I can change Phil to match the software. Wink

MyAutoEvents wrote:
Steve, you're half right.

By using MAE in the way discussed you will lose the ability to enfore number uniqueness across the event as that is part of the number assignment check that would be skipped in this scenario.

However, you would NOT lose the ability to import the entry list into AXWare. The assigned number is what is exported from MAE, so as long as every entry is assigned a number, there would be no problem.

The other alternative (and this is the last time I'll bring this up, I swear Wink ) is to use the MAE reserved number functionality as designed. This would restrict someone from taking a reserved number AND enforce the restriction mandating unique numbers across the event.
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phile



Joined: 07 Apr 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MyAutoEvents wrote:
Steve, you're half right.

By using MAE in the way discussed you will lose the ability to enfore number uniqueness across the event as that is part of the number assignment check that would be skipped in this scenario.

However, you would NOT lose the ability to import the entry list into AXWare. The assigned number is what is exported from MAE, so as long as every entry is assigned a number, there would be no problem.

The other alternative (and this is the last time I'll bring this up, I swear Wink ) is to use the MAE reserved number functionality as designed. This would restrict someone from taking a reserved number AND enforce the restriction mandating unique numbers across the event.



Steve Couture (why couldn't one of you guys be named Knute?), I am also the Council numbers guy and sometimes I add to the list every day. We allow people to pay for permanent numbers any time they like. I've constructed a very user-friendly system and I keep it up-to-date.

The other thing is that we allow people to use each others reserved numbers for co-drives and the like.

It is easier for me to handle everything than to have it partially automated.

The duplicate-number problem is no problem for me. Nobody would get a number on the list without my approval. I know how to check for duplicates. I do it often on my own permanent-numbers list to ensure that no typos have crept in (none have so far).

Steve Garnjobst (why couldn't one of you guys be named Knute?) is just playing devil's advocate because he doesn't want us to shoot ourselves in the foot. I understand that.
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, Steve G. explained your reserved number process. I was just being a pain. Wink

Sounds like you have a system all worked out that suits your needs.

Let me know if you need anything else from me.

(And feel free to call me Knute if it makes you feel better Laughing )
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phile



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PostPosted: Mon Apr 09, 2007 9:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MyAutoEvents wrote:

(And feel free to call me Knute if it makes you feel better Laughing )


It seems like half the guys in our club are either Steve or Dave.

Even my brother is named Steve.
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